The Public Option: Five Reasons Harry Reid Went For It

"Win or lose on this one, he will at least be able to tell liberals he gave his best effort to a cause that has, for them, become the most important element of health care reform."
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A Majority Leader with 60 seats shrugging his shoulders and saying "It just wasn't meant to be" isn't going to fly.

6. The smoke and mirrors that Obama has been giving this issue has been unprecedented. Flat out lies to the public on a so-called public option, and how much money will be saved due to all of the arm twisting of the CBO.
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7. Seniors have not been truly "whipped" into a voting block as of yet. The real money is still yet to be spent on making it known to Seniors how much of their Medicare benefit will be lost when this legislation is passed, if it gets that far.
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8. Media darlings like Karen Tumulty, who constantly press for health care reform, and simply lie about what the true costs will eventually be. That the so-called "savings" are really more smoke and mirror tactics by Obama and his henchmen. The tax payers of the US will start paying for this health care benefit now, but will not see any benefits until at least 2013.
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9. Polls do show most Americans want health care reform, but not THIS reform package. Americans want to see less costly and expensive reform passed first. They want legislation to stop the practice of pre-existing conditions. They want TORT reform. They want an investigation and abuse of Medicare stopped. All of these measures do not cost anything.

Hey Karen, just an fyi if you're reading this - as Paul Dirks points out in Joe's post below - his first link is going to his Outlook Exchange server logon screen. Might want to get the admins to disable the link.

KT, do you really believe that the "public option" (to be rechristened the "consumer option") will wind up saving money?

Joe "he's with us on everything but the war" Lieberman just indicated he will help Republicans filibuster.
Good thing all the Joe Klein's of the world told us in 2006 how terrible it would be if the Senate lost such an honest and noble man...who happens to be married to a medical industrial complex lobbyist.

Joe L needs some attention. Harry, give it to him so he'll shut up

6.Quoting Howard Dean: "It's the only thing that works."

http://www.powerlineblog.com/archives/2009/10/024804.php
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Interesting,.

"2. The CBO numbers. Another boost came from the Congressional Budget Office, which showed that a public option could save money, and that a strong public option could save even more. That puts conservatives in the unsettling position of standing for more spending."
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Isn't that whistling past the graveyard? Let's just assume that costs would go done, and that's real costs, not "projections" from the CBO. They still gotta sell it. The public believes costs go up, and conservatives can still make that case. It's not like the CBO's numbers are sacrosanct.

Oh so now the wingnuts want to throw the CBO under the bus! That's not what they were saying when CBO numbers bolstered their cause. They couldn't wait to tout their numbers when it came out over a trillion dollars, even though you were willing to focus on partial reports and unrevised figures. But of course now that the numbers are not in your favor, in fact show up your lies for the lies the rest of us always knew they were, the CBO has the credibility of some old hack scribbling on the back of a napkin. Let's face it, conservatives are absent anything even close to resembling integrity. They want to win regardless of how shameless they have to be in order to do so. They touted CBO as a non-partisan, unassailable research -- but now that they don't like the numbers they want to destroy the representation of the in favor of what that faulty industry report that got laughed out of the room?

KT:

1) I wonder how much that of that public opinion has to do with the rising unemployment rate and all the jobs Obama saved. Oh right he didn't save any.

2) Let's see the CBO analysis when all the Santa Claus' in the Demo side get done and the details are filled in tot he plan. There are parts of the plan unscored.

3)Just as the insurance company may have overplayed their hand, I have full confidence that the arrogant left will do the same. They alway sdo.

4) Horror stories. Hmm if this was done by conservatives you would be frothing about fear mongering. So I guess turnaround will be fair play.

5) It will take more than selling out the country to get Dingy Harry re-elected.

To sad, To bad, To Late. GOP goes down in Karmic flames. How foolish to be so infantile and petty. What the hell happened to unity of the people for the betterment of the collective whole. Those who think they are superior and above the ordinary citizen are beyond foolish. The people have spoken and they mean business. GOP distortion machine can try to lie, fabricate and falsify all they wish because the people will decide. The people have witnessed and the people will judge accordingly. GOP leaders have led the members in the senate and congress down a slippery road that they will not be able to climb up ever again. Dont they get everyone in the world,is now saying the GOP is the biggest embarrasment to humanity, the U.S. and they insist on showcasing their true ignorant colors. How dare they hold the country and the advancement of good positive long over do change hostage. It is over GOP rover, cant fetch a nasty spirited ol dog a bone no more. Food thought. AMA wanted Pot kept legal, in the 30s because the medicinal properties where very apparent but GOP senators back in the day decided their personal puritan conservative agenda was more important and the burgeoning pharma giants would have lost mega billions had Pot remained legal. How sad that they are devoid of true logic. Do the math, the citizens are speaking loud n clear. Pot will put over 1 billion in taxes per state in the federal coffers every year.Moron GOPers that is 50 Billion a year to our much needed and depleted coffers. Additionally, Google Morris Fishbaum and then Google Royal Richard Rife and learn the hoax that has been played out on the citizens of humanity. Much dark action occureed in the early 30s that set the stage for the greatest crime against humanity. Wake up earthlings and read, Google does not hide, expunge or conceal the truth. Read the shocking and absolute despicable truth about Morris Fishbaum and how he bought up secretively and quitely 100% of the AMA and then expunged and erased from history and the medical journals most likely one of the greatest discoveries, inventions and gifts to all humanity. How sad, how very sad that the greed of a few absolute low souls decided their profits were more important than Royal Richard Rife getting divine inspiration from the creator and coming up with a pain free device that virtually cured every disease know to mankind. You will also find the GOP had there "Party of No" hands deep in the tyranical conspiracy against mankind. Merchants of disease, death and pain be damned your days are numbered and your myth will be exposed. Angels in the outfield are lining up by the legions and the truth will be revealed. Guarentee when the american people finally get wind of the actions that were orchestrated by Morris Fishbaum and company, the people will rightly demand reversal of decades of dispicable actions. Pray to the high creator, for it is time for pure unadulterated truth to take the stage.

GOP has a reason to be very scared. Mid 2010 elections will throw them one heck of a surprise. Fools when the honorable president of the United States offers to work with you, behind closed doors you rant n you rave, but then you bring out to the american people assuming we are idiots and dont have clue. If you think you gained one iota of increased support for all your whacked out town hall scream sessions you are so sadly mistaken. Not only will go down in flaming defeat in the mid 2010 elections you have insured that a president will be ushered in a 2nd term with the largest landslide victory ever and history will show the collective body of work under the honorable commander in chief of this great nation will portrayed by historians as the single most polarizing figure along side washington, lincoln, truman and kennedy. Go President Obama Go !!!! The world leaders recognize that U.S. has a thoughtful, kind hearted, compassionate and highly intelligent leader that has been overdue for decades and will effect sweeping change for the betterment of all citizens of the U.S. and more importantly of this grand majestic planet called earth.

[...] While it is not single-payer, it is far better than what we have now. The health care reform bills are moving their way to a vote, and the public option is so far being included. [...]

Voters in California are talking about universal health care here:

http://www.jorgensenforcongress.com/2009/10/universal-health-care-is-in-sight/

Facial Body Language Tells the Truth. Look at Cantors face. The tight jaw bone, the clenched muscles in his face say that he is 100% lying when he says there is time to salvage a bi-partisan agenda. GOPers have been so ignorant, they dont realize that they are very public and very visible lie detectors of their own decision. GOPers apprear to be freaking out in grand fashion, everyday they march closer and closer to the demise of their Grand Ol Party of distortion, deception and denial of the existence of Truth. Do they not realize the creator sees and hears all. They hide behind religion, but in their dark devoid of compassion hearts they do not care to act in a truly unadulterated manner of pure action. In grade school we are all taught about fair sportsmanlike conduct must be GOPers got blinded by momentary money, power and the adulation of fleeting fame. They lost the latino vote, they never had the black vote and now they will lose rank n file white intelligent human beings, contrary to what the GOP leaders disseminate to their blind robotic ranks, many of my friends are loyal GOPers of multiple generations and everyday they get more embarressed and feel very ashamed that the tiny minority at the top of their party takes an unconditional position of blatant little boy pouting in the corner and now I am hearing the unheard of GOPers are quitely forming their own intelligent opinions. Better get ready McConnell, Boehner, Cantor, Pence, and the propped up puppet Steele,etc going down the sink hole into oblivion in the 2010 midterms and the people who are with our great president will be smiling large and proud that our once great nation will be rebuilt on foundation sound practical and very logical actions to insure a better world for the future generations of children in the U.S. and ultimitely across this great planet.

For all those slamming Canada. You are being fueled by the GOP lie machine. Several friends and relatives in Canada, paint the true pictures.

The level of care for every citizen far exceeds the current level of care in the U.S. unless you are fortunate to be very wealthy.

Why would anyone want to pay so much of their hard earned money to recieve the same care that every citizen is typically untitled for free.

Talks of long lines are absolute falsehoods and fabrications and pure distoritions of the true reality.

Never have I heard any canadians slam their universal health and why would they? It is lunacy to think that we have it better. Pretty damn embarrasing that the greatest country in the world nows ranks 50th in the world for quality of health care, that is beyond sad, that is totally crazy and devoid of any sensible logic.

If americans ever are allowed to know the real truth north of the border, there would an immediate overwhelming majority. Too bad the GOP has distorted the facts so bad that they have senior citizens in such a state of confusion and befuddlement that they try to capitalize on those less fortunate like hyennas that gather around the carcas after the lions are full. Shame, Shame to pull a nuclear cloud fear tactic from Cheneys book of pathetic cowardly action, desperation and fear of the GOPers and the wealthy who fuel the vitrolic calculated fabrications for their elite minority ever shrinking base of cry babies. Let em all walk for a month in the shoes of the millions of great honest hardworking citizens, maybe just maybe some would wake up but many would convince themselves with self induced lies not to look in the mirror and see how they have fallen to new lows of lows with their smug holier than thou smirks and rolling eyes. Canadians dont let elected officials dictate what is best for the population, the citizens in canada dictate truthful action that benefits the whole not a select privaleged few.

You must be smoking something because thats a load of crap. You just don't like what you've been hearing so you're ignoring facts.

I was born in Canada, and now live in the United States. Stop slamming my country. Honestly, it runs like a well oiled machine, and Canadians have all the freedoms you do in the United States, in comparison to the US.

vezuvion1 is VERY frightening. The political philosophy has NEVER been one of working for the "common good" as you profess. Instead it was meant as a place where we EACH have the OPPORTUNITY to be successful. By each improving our stock in life, our country as a whole is raised. Your changing of words meanings is also hilarious. Now, "working with you" means you will come all the way over to my side and I will ignore all your amendmants and bill proposals. If you do not come completely over to my side, you are not "working with me." If you have never heard canadiens slam their own healthcare, you might want to expand your horizons. I've personally heard/read large numbers of canadiens saying they hope we don't go down the same healthcare road as them. You are so blinded by your ideology you can't see past the end of your own nose. YOU are the one distorting facts and manipulating word's meanings worse than any of those you claim are perpetrating said acts. You forget that a government big enough and powerful enough to provide you with anything is also big enough and powerful enough to take the same thing from you. We have come to a said state in America where we believe we have some right to the hard earned money of other Americans. We are giving up our freedom for security. Freedom and security are the antithesis of each other. The more security you have, the less freedom you have. Ask the man in solitary confinement. He is extremely safe. Would be very difficult for someone to harm him. However, he has NO freedom. That is not a trade I'm willing to make.

Universal coverage and the public option are very appealing but every government study shows that premiums and costs would not go down but would instead increase. There is not one government program in existence that has not increased ten to more than one hundred times the cost the government initially claimed it would cost. Food stamps have increased by 10,000 (yes, ten thousand) percent from what they were initially claimed to cost the government, and no sane person believes the number of poor people in this country has increased by 10,000 percent.

All those who criticize people who are worried about the costs... beware! We will be paying more money than we are now, and the only way the government will be able to keep costs down is to ration care--which means that certain medical tests you can get now, you will not be able to with a public option. If you think that's fine, then great. Let's just hope that until you die at a ripe old age you are never, ever sick because under a government plan certain tests will be denied to you. And for the elderly, all I can say is good luck! Obama wants to save $800 billion over ten years by cutting Medicare costs. It's an absurdity that digitizing medical records will save that many billions. If you truly believe you can cut out $800 billion dollars from Medicare without cutting benefits and rationing care, then I have a bridge in Brooklyn I would like to sell you.

Unless and until the government is going to seriously change the way the insurance companies, trial lawyers and pharmaceutical companies do business, any system will fail. John McCain stated during the campaign that the Republicans are in bed with the insurance companies, the Democrats are in bed with the trial lawyers and both parties are in bed with the pharmaceutical companies. He was 100 percent correct--we can bandy about terms like "public option" all we want, but until we rein in the the above three groups that are bankrupting the health care system, nothing much will change. Unless we change the above, a government plan will not save money and will end up severely rationing care for everyone.

True presidential leadership involves going after the insurance companies, trial lawyers and drug companies, and doing what's best for the American people, not one political party. Rhetoric will not pay for a good healthcare system, nor will it correct the problems that are putting more and more Americans on the edge of bankruptcy and despair due to rising healthcare costs and denials of coverage.

re: #4- I really don't think it's wise to turn 1/7 of the economy over to the government based on anecdotes.
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Also, for every horror story you hear about healthcare here, there is a horror story about healthcare in countries with a government-run system. I just don't mention them because, again, I don't think it's wise to base a decision of this magnitude off of anecdotes.

Hmmm, I'm the wack job that would do something to the president, but you are the one frothing at the mouth. Interesting. As far as the canadien thing, if you can reference what you have or have not heard from them, so can I. Blind robotic follower? What a hoot! I follow nobody except my own intellect. Yet, you are attacking me for my beliefs and making VAST leaps to conclusions about me. Yet, I am the irrational one. If that's not the pot calling the kettle black, I don't know what it. You can choose to try and render my remarks moot by leaping to the worst possible conclusions about me, but you would be very wrong and engaging in the sort of intollerance I thought Libs abhored. You are dangerous because of what you believe. "for the common good". Will "from each according to his ability to each according to his own" be the next great socialist/communist term to flow from your oh so enlightened and tolerant lips? Grow up. Other than saying you are dangerous (which I firmly believe your beliefs to be), I made no attack or assumptions about you, yet you attack and make all the worst assumptions about me you can. It may help you to belief the opposition is all wack-o, but you do so at your own peril. I'm sure your alleged military service has taught you the dangers of underestimation the opponents. You are some piece of work. Rant away, my friend.

I'd also hazard a guess many of the people criticizing Lieberman were also criticizing Republicans for calling Snowe and the like RINO's. Liberal mentality, it's only bad if you do it. When we do it, it's just "speaking truth to power" or some other inane phrase we've come up with to snow the uninformed.

The administration should propose to try to administer a health care trial in a state or two. It should use the data on real costs of the trial for rate setting. If the government can prove they can lower costs and provide better care, who could oppose a public option. The insurance industry should be able to monitor and audit the government trials. I doubt the government could administer anything well, but let them show they can in a state or two; Georgia and Kansas maybe.

Still unanswered is how many doctors and dentists will participate. None of the dentists in my local area will even participate with Delta Dental and many doctors won't participate with Blue Cross. How is the government going to get health care provider participation? Insurance that no local provider, or only a few poorly thought of providers, is no insurance for the poor.

Don't see any real cost containment. Politicians don't contain costs, they protect rich donors and that runs up costs everywhere. Not a bad idea; but like utopia I doubt the government can do it well.