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	<title>Comments on: Paying for Health Care: Did Obama Have the Answer?</title>
	<atom:link href="http://swampland.blogs.time.com/2009/07/10/paying-for-health-care-did-obama-have-the-answer/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://swampland.blogs.time.com/2009/07/10/paying-for-health-care-did-obama-have-the-answer/</link>
	<description>A blog about politics.</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Wed, 09 Dec 2009 06:12:28 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: retiredsoldier</title>
		<link>http://swampland.blogs.time.com/2009/07/10/paying-for-health-care-did-obama-have-the-answer/comment-page-1/#comment-106788</link>
		<dc:creator>retiredsoldier</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Nov 2009 06:28:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://swampland.blogs.time.com/?p=14472#comment-106788</guid>
		<description>I have always viewed passive taxation to be the price I pay for Government Services that would have to be purchased from private industry if the Government didn&#039;t provide them. In that event, I prefer to pay the Government because when I have a complaint I have a live body I can complain to, not a voice at the other end of the phone line who - more and more - actually lives and works in India.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have always viewed passive taxation to be the price I pay for Government Services that would have to be purchased from private industry if the Government didn't provide them. In that event, I prefer to pay the Government because when I have a complaint I have a live body I can complain to, not a voice at the other end of the phone line who - more and more - actually lives and works in India.</p>
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		<title>By: lasikexpert</title>
		<link>http://swampland.blogs.time.com/2009/07/10/paying-for-health-care-did-obama-have-the-answer/comment-page-2/#comment-106746</link>
		<dc:creator>lasikexpert</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 01 Nov 2009 17:37:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://swampland.blogs.time.com/?p=14472#comment-106746</guid>
		<description>I think that LASIK should be looked at as a model to reduce health care costs.  Competition and the free market model is always the most efficient way to deliver goods and services.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think that LASIK should be looked at as a model to reduce health care costs.  Competition and the free market model is always the most efficient way to deliver goods and services.</p>
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		<title>By: Pallin&#8217; Around With The Liberal Media &#171; Sarah Palin Truth Squad</title>
		<link>http://swampland.blogs.time.com/2009/07/10/paying-for-health-care-did-obama-have-the-answer/comment-page-2/#comment-81336</link>
		<dc:creator>Pallin&#8217; Around With The Liberal Media &#171; Sarah Palin Truth Squad</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 18 Jul 2009 21:41:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://swampland.blogs.time.com/?p=14472#comment-81336</guid>
		<description>[...] a transparently false statement, seeing as funding questions are routinely focused on by the press, but that fact isn&#8217;t mentioned by Time. And when she isn&#8217;t pushing the [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] a transparently false statement, seeing as funding questions are routinely focused on by the press, but that fact isn&#8217;t mentioned by Time. And when she isn&#8217;t pushing the [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Matthew Yglesias &#187; Health Care Financing Options</title>
		<link>http://swampland.blogs.time.com/2009/07/10/paying-for-health-care-did-obama-have-the-answer/comment-page-2/#comment-81011</link>
		<dc:creator>Matthew Yglesias &#187; Health Care Financing Options</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 16 Jul 2009 21:26:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://swampland.blogs.time.com/?p=14472#comment-81011</guid>
		<description>[...] proposed in the first place—limited itemized deductions for rich people and you get $318 billion over ten years. That&#8217;s about as progressive in its distributive impact as what the House is proposing, but [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] proposed in the first place—limited itemized deductions for rich people and you get $318 billion over ten years. That&#8217;s about as progressive in its distributive impact as what the House is proposing, but [...]</p>
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		<title>By: 53_3</title>
		<link>http://swampland.blogs.time.com/2009/07/10/paying-for-health-care-did-obama-have-the-answer/comment-page-2/#comment-80075</link>
		<dc:creator>53_3</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 12 Jul 2009 14:14:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://swampland.blogs.time.com/?p=14472#comment-80075</guid>
		<description>retiredsoldier:
I don&#039;t yet have to face the conundrums you face, but I know that it is coming.  My wife is disabled and if I didn&#039;t have my coverage on her, she would now be Medicare only.

Try getting a doctor to take a patient Medicare only these days, and you&#039;ll see why I&#039;m so harsh about that refusal clause.

Seems to me that if anything, you deserve at least the bennies that the congressweasels get.  Hell, you&#039;ve done more for our country than they ever did...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>retiredsoldier:<br />
I don't yet have to face the conundrums you face, but I know that it is coming.  My wife is disabled and if I didn't have my coverage on her, she would now be Medicare only.</p>
<p>Try getting a doctor to take a patient Medicare only these days, and you'll see why I'm so harsh about that refusal clause.</p>
<p>Seems to me that if anything, you deserve at least the bennies that the congressweasels get.  Hell, you've done more for our country than they ever did...</p>
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		<title>By: retiredsoldier</title>
		<link>http://swampland.blogs.time.com/2009/07/10/paying-for-health-care-did-obama-have-the-answer/comment-page-2/#comment-80069</link>
		<dc:creator>retiredsoldier</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 12 Jul 2009 12:37:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://swampland.blogs.time.com/?p=14472#comment-80069</guid>
		<description>If you recall, Obama said that he wanted Healthcare reform at a price that would not affect Middle Income Americans. It seems that the Congressional Democrats have finally heard his message, and are addressing his primary point.. I have some personal experience with this issue because when the workers where I worked before Retirement wanted an improved healthcare plan from our employer, our negotiations resulted in the original plan staying in place, but with an available overlay for an additional $13.00 per Pay Period from our check to double the benefits provided, which meant an additional $338.00 per Year for the increased coverage. In addition, current employees pay an additional 1.5% of their annual salary to pay for healthcare for Retirees - like myself - who are old enough to retire, but are not old enough to collect Medicare. And yet, there still are landmines out there for those who are covered by Insurance.

My Army career spanned from 1967 – 2008, and involved a period in the Regular Army, the New York Army National Guard, and the Retired Reserve. When I was in the Regular Army, I was covered under what was then the Army’s all-inclusive program of Healthcare for ALL members and their families. When I transferred to the National Guard, I lost all Military Healthcare except when I was actually on Active Duty. When I transferred to the Retired Reserve, I lost all Military healthcare, PERIOD, but had the promise that when I achieved Retired status I would regain my Healthcare In the mean time, I had access to the VA’s Healthcare, but – at the time – the VA’s program was a primary example of Healthcare Rationing. Before continuing with this part of the story, let me spend time with my Civilian Employer to round out this picture. When I left the Regular Army, and went to school on the GI Bill, I was employed by a series of Private employers who had crappy benefit packages before I ended up the Transit System in NYC, where I was covered by GHI.

When I first started with Transit, my healthcare package, mentioned at the top of this posting, was paid 100% by Transit, and I had reasonably good coverage that met my needs. I stayed with Transit from 1980 through 2009, when I finally Retired for the last time. As I stated above, portions of the package were later transferred onto my shoulders to maintain the package as it was originally constructed, but the benefits actually either stayed the same or got better as the transition was made. Now, I am Retired, but not old enough for Medicare, so the investment I made while working is paying for my GHI, which has been reduced only by the lack of a Dental package.

Returning to the Military, this is where it gets hairy. When I turned 60, I was transferred to the Retired NCO List, and got my Pension. I also had my Healthcare restored, but – by this time – the Military had totally revamped its healthcare program all out of proportion. The healthcare I recall as a new Private is still available, but there is now an Insurance package called Tricare that is involved in controlling the costs.

For those on Active Duty, the package is called Tricare Prime, and it does everything that the old program did, but it polices the costs much better than the old system did. There are other packages for those in the Reserves and National Guard, and the coverage gets worse as you descend the ladder, but let me not digress. I have Tricare Standard as a Retiree, and it is structured as a Secondary Carrier, meaning that those things that GHI won’t cover Tricare Standard should – although they won’t.

I’ve worn glasses since I was Six, and have had coverage as part of my Healthcare since I first graduated High School and entered the Army. I’ve always had to pay Deductables, and I’ve never looked on that as a chore. Now, however, I am Retired, and I’ve found out that while GHI – through a sub-carrier – will pay the same 30% of the bill for Lenses, and $80.00 for Frames, Tricare doesn’t pay ANYTHING for Glasses after the Patient reaches the age of Six (I ended up eating the remaining $916.00), with some very interesting exceptions. They will pay for Glasses when they are part of a program that involves Eye Surgery, INCLUDING LASIK. That is significant because eye surgery is NOT inexpensive, and LASIK is VERY expensive. The reason why they will pay for eye surgery is actually very good for the American population as a whole. The US Military broke the Dam on paying for LASIK because they decided that they needed it for two things. First of all there are several jobs in the Military that require vision that isn’t worse than 20-40, and the NIH has achieved sufficient evidence that LASIK – when performed by a competent Surgeon – can always produce at least 20-40 Vision. So, persons who come into the Military today who want to be Pilots, or do other work that requires good vision without Glasses are offered – free of charge – LASIK treatment to allow them to pass their Medical Exam. Secondly, the Military always works hand-in-hand with NIH, and NIH needs a large database of successful LASIK procedures so that the costs can be regularized enough so that the Insurance Industry can start moving LASIK from the Cosmetic category to the Necessary category. 

This brings me to my point. They are willing to cover me for eye surgery, AND throw in a pair of Glasses – if necessary – in the interim, but if I just want them to pick up at least a portion of the remainder of the bill that GHI nibbled at, they won’t contribute one penny. It seems to me that the glasses should qualify at least in the “Wellness” category, and as a means to control the cost of other procedures that might become necessary if I don’t have them.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If you recall, Obama said that he wanted Healthcare reform at a price that would not affect Middle Income Americans. It seems that the Congressional Democrats have finally heard his message, and are addressing his primary point.. I have some personal experience with this issue because when the workers where I worked before Retirement wanted an improved healthcare plan from our employer, our negotiations resulted in the original plan staying in place, but with an available overlay for an additional $13.00 per Pay Period from our check to double the benefits provided, which meant an additional $338.00 per Year for the increased coverage. In addition, current employees pay an additional 1.5% of their annual salary to pay for healthcare for Retirees - like myself - who are old enough to retire, but are not old enough to collect Medicare. And yet, there still are landmines out there for those who are covered by Insurance.</p>
<p>My Army career spanned from 1967 – 2008, and involved a period in the Regular Army, the New York Army National Guard, and the Retired Reserve. When I was in the Regular Army, I was covered under what was then the Army's all-inclusive program of Healthcare for ALL members and their families. When I transferred to the National Guard, I lost all Military Healthcare except when I was actually on Active Duty. When I transferred to the Retired Reserve, I lost all Military healthcare, PERIOD, but had the promise that when I achieved Retired status I would regain my Healthcare In the mean time, I had access to the VA's Healthcare, but – at the time – the VA's program was a primary example of Healthcare Rationing. Before continuing with this part of the story, let me spend time with my Civilian Employer to round out this picture. When I left the Regular Army, and went to school on the GI Bill, I was employed by a series of Private employers who had crappy benefit packages before I ended up the Transit System in NYC, where I was covered by GHI.</p>
<p>When I first started with Transit, my healthcare package, mentioned at the top of this posting, was paid 100% by Transit, and I had reasonably good coverage that met my needs. I stayed with Transit from 1980 through 2009, when I finally Retired for the last time. As I stated above, portions of the package were later transferred onto my shoulders to maintain the package as it was originally constructed, but the benefits actually either stayed the same or got better as the transition was made. Now, I am Retired, but not old enough for Medicare, so the investment I made while working is paying for my GHI, which has been reduced only by the lack of a Dental package.</p>
<p>Returning to the Military, this is where it gets hairy. When I turned 60, I was transferred to the Retired NCO List, and got my Pension. I also had my Healthcare restored, but – by this time – the Military had totally revamped its healthcare program all out of proportion. The healthcare I recall as a new Private is still available, but there is now an Insurance package called Tricare that is involved in controlling the costs.</p>
<p>For those on Active Duty, the package is called Tricare Prime, and it does everything that the old program did, but it polices the costs much better than the old system did. There are other packages for those in the Reserves and National Guard, and the coverage gets worse as you descend the ladder, but let me not digress. I have Tricare Standard as a Retiree, and it is structured as a Secondary Carrier, meaning that those things that GHI won't cover Tricare Standard should – although they won't.</p>
<p>I've worn glasses since I was Six, and have had coverage as part of my Healthcare since I first graduated High School and entered the Army. I've always had to pay Deductables, and I've never looked on that as a chore. Now, however, I am Retired, and I've found out that while GHI – through a sub-carrier – will pay the same 30% of the bill for Lenses, and $80.00 for Frames, Tricare doesn't pay ANYTHING for Glasses after the Patient reaches the age of Six (I ended up eating the remaining $916.00), with some very interesting exceptions. They will pay for Glasses when they are part of a program that involves Eye Surgery, INCLUDING LASIK. That is significant because eye surgery is NOT inexpensive, and LASIK is VERY expensive. The reason why they will pay for eye surgery is actually very good for the American population as a whole. The US Military broke the Dam on paying for LASIK because they decided that they needed it for two things. First of all there are several jobs in the Military that require vision that isn't worse than 20-40, and the NIH has achieved sufficient evidence that LASIK – when performed by a competent Surgeon – can always produce at least 20-40 Vision. So, persons who come into the Military today who want to be Pilots, or do other work that requires good vision without Glasses are offered – free of charge – LASIK treatment to allow them to pass their Medical Exam. Secondly, the Military always works hand-in-hand with NIH, and NIH needs a large database of successful LASIK procedures so that the costs can be regularized enough so that the Insurance Industry can start moving LASIK from the Cosmetic category to the Necessary category. </p>
<p>This brings me to my point. They are willing to cover me for eye surgery, AND throw in a pair of Glasses – if necessary – in the interim, but if I just want them to pick up at least a portion of the remainder of the bill that GHI nibbled at, they won't contribute one penny. It seems to me that the glasses should qualify at least in the “Wellness” category, and as a means to control the cost of other procedures that might become necessary if I don't have them.</p>
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		<title>By: 53_3</title>
		<link>http://swampland.blogs.time.com/2009/07/10/paying-for-health-care-did-obama-have-the-answer/comment-page-2/#comment-80065</link>
		<dc:creator>53_3</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 12 Jul 2009 04:42:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://swampland.blogs.time.com/?p=14472#comment-80065</guid>
		<description>The GOPers and Dittoheads in particular have spent vast amounts of money and time ignoring adages that say a lot about our country and ourselves. 

Among others:

You get judged by the company you keep.
Do unto others as you would have them do unto you.
Keep your friends close and your enemies closer.

Let&#039;s not even get &lt;i&gt;into&lt;/i&gt; the Ten Commandments, which, even though they were carved in stone, have been relentlessly shredded by these weasels...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The GOPers and Dittoheads in particular have spent vast amounts of money and time ignoring adages that say a lot about our country and ourselves. </p>
<p>Among others:</p>
<p>You get judged by the company you keep.<br />
Do unto others as you would have them do unto you.<br />
Keep your friends close and your enemies closer.</p>
<p>Let's not even get <i>into</i> the Ten Commandments, which, even though they were carved in stone, have been relentlessly shredded by these weasels...</p>
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		<title>By: jcapan</title>
		<link>http://swampland.blogs.time.com/2009/07/10/paying-for-health-care-did-obama-have-the-answer/comment-page-2/#comment-80041</link>
		<dc:creator>jcapan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 11 Jul 2009 21:48:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://swampland.blogs.time.com/?p=14472#comment-80041</guid>
		<description>must come to reflect... our thinking ... about</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>must come to reflect... our thinking ... about</p>
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		<title>By: jcapan</title>
		<link>http://swampland.blogs.time.com/2009/07/10/paying-for-health-care-did-obama-have-the-answer/comment-page-2/#comment-80039</link>
		<dc:creator>jcapan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 11 Jul 2009 21:46:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://swampland.blogs.time.com/?p=14472#comment-80039</guid>
		<description>Come on guys, you mean it&#039;s not &quot;trickling down&quot;!? Here&#039;s David Cay Johnston being interviewed by Amy Goodman (i.e. two journalists for those unaccustomed to such hereabouts):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SHDkI1kwgbo

Note, this is part II--the entire interview is excellent, but this segment is most relevant to re/redistribution.

I&#039;d add that the same parasistic rel&#039;ship applies globally--1st world wealth and privilege stands in direct correlation with poverty we can barely fathom in a nearly static developing world.  IMO, we can&#039;t have a just system in the US or here in J-town until that system applies the same sense of humanity to the poor, mostly brown and yellow people producing our goods.

The old adage &quot;every society is judged by how it treats the least fortunate amongst them&quot; must come to reflect about the global village too.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Come on guys, you mean it's not "trickling down"!? Here's David Cay Johnston being interviewed by Amy Goodman (i.e. two journalists for those unaccustomed to such hereabouts):</p>
<p><a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SHDkI1kwgbo" rel="nofollow">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SHDkI1kwgbo</a></p>
<p>Note, this is part II--the entire interview is excellent, but this segment is most relevant to re/redistribution.</p>
<p>I'd add that the same parasistic rel'ship applies globally--1st world wealth and privilege stands in direct correlation with poverty we can barely fathom in a nearly static developing world.  IMO, we can't have a just system in the US or here in J-town until that system applies the same sense of humanity to the poor, mostly brown and yellow people producing our goods.</p>
<p>The old adage "every society is judged by how it treats the least fortunate amongst them" must come to reflect about the global village too.</p>
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		<title>By: shepherdwong</title>
		<link>http://swampland.blogs.time.com/2009/07/10/paying-for-health-care-did-obama-have-the-answer/comment-page-2/#comment-80033</link>
		<dc:creator>shepherdwong</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 11 Jul 2009 20:48:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://swampland.blogs.time.com/?p=14472#comment-80033</guid>
		<description>I tend to think of it as &lt;i&gt;re&lt;/i&gt;-redistribution since the wealth of the top 1% is often really &quot;earned&quot; from the work of others.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I tend to think of it as <i>re</i>-redistribution since the wealth of the top 1% is often really "earned" from the work of others.</p>
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