A Public Plan (Cont'd.)

I read that, too, KT. But Kent Conrad claims he does not have the votes for a public plan. Of course he will re-discover who actually votes when he is next up for election. For now his voters are in the Senate. And didn't Dodd say the Senate is owned by the banks. Let's add insurance and pharmacare gangs to that mix. This is too depressing, as is the news from Iran.

This is one of the greatest examples of how little the political will of the people matters anymore, be it from the left, right, or center. This is just proof of how lopsided the balance of power between the will of the people and the will of the corporations are. More than anything, this chasm has me discouraged of the future of this nation. What happens to a nation that doesn't listen or respond to its people?

"When asked their opinion of specific changes being considered in Washington, three-fourths of those surveyed said they favored requiring health insurers to cover anyone, regardless of pre-existing medical conditions."
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I'm not sure what people do not understand about "for profit." Insurance companies can not make a profit covering pre-existing conditions. Does any one seriously think that if the government required health insurance companies to cover pre-existing conditions, the insurance companies wont' respond by not covering entire conditions at all? What you will end up with is the government picking up the tab any way.

Some interesting cross numbers.
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"One in four said that in the last 12 months they or someone in their household had cut back on medications because of the expense, and one in five said someone had skipped a recommended test or treatment."
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"Eighty-six percent of those polled said rising costs posed a serious economic threat."
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And then..."And only a fourth said that keeping health costs down was a more urgent need than providing coverage for the country's nearly 50 million uninsured"
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Perhaps people are more altruistic than I thought. Or maybe just more sophisticated as having more people covered will bring down costs. Fewer emergency room visits, preventive care, etc.

"Does any one seriously think that if the government required health insurance companies to cover pre-existing conditions, the insurance companies wont' respond by not covering entire conditions at all? "
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gunny, that's why the conversation being framed as universal insurance rather than universal healthcare is so damaging.

"President Obama as they try to address the health system's substantial problems without igniting fears that people could lose what they like."
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People are going to lose what they like any way. All they have to do right now is to get sick enough.

Health care cost do not discriminate, Fifty percent of Republicans said they were for a public plan in this poll.
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Here are some more statistics that Halparin posted.
http://thepage.time.com/more-from-the-nytcbs-news-poll-on-health-care/

CNN is showing apparently new protests in Iran. The Iranian government has been pulling all the old tricks of arresting the supposed leaders, hoping this will all die down and its not working.

It was Dick Durbin who said the banks owned the Senate. Campaign finance reform is our only salvation. They don't represent "us". They don't. Does anybody really believe the people on North Dakota are clamoring for Kent Conrad to jump in the metaphorical hot tub with big pharma and big HMO?
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Really?

It is harder for Rush Limbaugh to tell wingnuts that their healthcare is wonderful when they know it isn't. He has strong listenership in rural manufacturing areas with cultural conservatives. The problem is that they are underinsured like crazy out there.
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Sure Mary Landrieu, Ben Nelson, Kent Conrad are bought and paid for, so there is that... but even wingnuts are not crazy enough to know what their health insurance experience has been like.

Roger Cohen has an excellent post up about the events in Iran.
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I don't know where this uprising is leading. I do know some police units are wavering. That commander talking about his family was not alone. There were other policemen complaining about the unruly Basijis. Some security forces just stood and watched. “All together, all together, don't be scared,” the crowd shouted.
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I also know that Iran's women stand in the vanguard. For days now, I've seen them urging less courageous men on. I've seen them get beaten and return to the fray. “Why are you sitting there?” one shouted at a couple of men perched on the sidewalk on Saturday. “Get up! Get up!”
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Another green-eyed woman, Mahin, aged 52, staggered into an alley clutching her face and in tears. Then, against the urging of those around her, she limped back into the crowd moving west toward Freedom Square. Cries of “Death to the dictator!” and “We want liberty!” accompanied her.
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There were people of all ages. I saw an old man on crutches, middle-aged office workers and bands of teenagers. Unlike the student revolts of 2003 and 1999, this movement is broad.
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“Can't the United Nations help us?” one woman asked me. I said I doubted that very much. “So,” she said, “we are on our own.”
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http://www.nytimes.com/2009/06/21/opinion/21tehran.html?ref=opinion

While 85 percent of respondents said the health care system needed to be fundamentally changed or completely rebuilt, 77 percent said they were very or somewhat satisfied with the quality of their own care.
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This is the actual wording of the quality of care question: "What about the health care you receive? Are you generally satisfied or dissatisfied with the quality of the health care you receive? Would you say you are very (satisfied/dissatisfied) or somewhat (satisfied/dissatisfied)?"
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Couldn't that be read as asking about your satisfaction with your doctors and other medical personnel you interact with? I'm not sure that's particularly relevant to this discussion. It's quite possible to like your doctor's care but dislike your health care plan.
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“It is the responsibility of the government to guarantee insurance for all,” said Juanita Lomaz, a 65-year-old office worker from Bakersfield, Calif. “But my care will get worse because they'll have to limit care in order to cover everyone.”
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That's quite encouraging. Lomaz is buying into rather absurd attacks on government health care - French office workers get better health care than American office workers - but still maintaining her support for health care reform. The generosity is also nice to see.

@Trifecta. Hate to disagree with you but I think you are totally wrong about Limbaugh and Republican voters. They are MORE than crazy enough to believe that their health care is fantastic. And if there are problems it is because of the Mexicans or, as Limbaugh said last week, people who exercise. He actually said that people who exercise, ride bikes, etc. and get hurt are the ones who are driving up health care costs.
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One thing you can also count on is that the mainstream media won't do a much better job than Limbaugh is shedding light on difficult questions. To quote Atrios, here is who is on the Sunday morning talking head shows:
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This Week has Lindsey Graham, Chris Dodd, and a panel recorded in 1996 with Sam Donaldson, Cokie Roberts, George Will, and Robert Reich.
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Face the Nation has President John McCain.
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Meet the Press has Netanyahu, Secretary of Defense Sam Nunn, and Chief Justice Fred Thompson.
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Lets take a closer look at Meet the Press. Their guests this week include Sam Nunn and Fred Thompson: two guys who are out of elected office, and who didn't have that much power when they did hold elected office. You can be sure that the lies and misinformation that Nunn, Thompson, and Netanyahu throw up today will be accepted as fact by David Gregory.
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It is really hard to fathom how Gregory, whose ratings are collapsing, would choose to bring on Nunn and Thompson. Really?! At a time when the US is deep into reforming health care and the Iranians are in the midst of a huge political moment, Gregory reaches out to a relic and an actor to provide insight to his audience - his rapidly dwindling audience.
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Maybe the reason that newspapers and television news are collapsing is completely unrelated to the Internet. Maybe the reason is that people have every reason to believe that anonymous tweets have more intellectual honesty than the Washington Post or NBC's Meet the Press.
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And people wonder what Americans are ignorant?! Tim Russell and

gysgt213, I had noticed that women seemed to be very active in the protests.
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I was just thinking yesterday that until the protests started being suppressed more violently, they must have been a lot of fun, like Joe suggested. For one thing, young men and women don't get to spend a lot of time together in Iran, and protests are of course great occasions for little romances to develop.

"It is really hard to fathom how Gregory, whose ratings are collapsing, would choose to bring on Nunn and Thompson"
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You don't go on air with the guests you want, you go on air with the guests you can get. Gregory may be so bad that "name" guests are taking a pass.

The news media has been pushing the Republicans on the GOVERNMENT plan, so now will say the American people do not really understand what a Public plan is.
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I guess the next thing will be if the people polled understood this question?
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Willingness to pay higher taxes so all can have health care: 57% willing, 37% not willing, 6% no opinion

Among those making less than $50,000: 64% willing, 27% not willing, 8% no opinion

Among those making more than $50,000: 52% willing, 44% not willing, 4% no opinion

Rose 83 I have been closely watching the women since I noticed how many were participating on the streets in the runoff to the election.
They have had a major presence since.

Sorta off topic, but not really. This Sully post: Why Froomkin Was Fired, explains why the media's failure to call bull$hit makes it impossible to have a substantive debate about much of anything in this country. And McCain will be shouting drivel without pushback on two, count em two, Sunday shows this morning.

Karen:
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Thanks for not relentlessly ignoring the dichotomy. It is one of the two reasons that I've been so harsh in my criticism.
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The other reason is the continued misconception that making doctor's care more efficient is what is needed to bring down costs. Again, it is not.
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I would like to see you be more substantive and address the problem of enormously inflated hospital/clinic fees.

To bad Time magazine does not have any reports on staff who are willing to ask elected representatives why they are opposed to a plan that 72% of the public is for and then persist until they get an answer. Gerorge S. on ABC sure won't. He let Lindsey Gram get away with the Lutz talking points then giggled with the pannel about health care for twenty minutes. Wvng has it right about the media's failure to call it.

@dfh it's why blogs hold so much power and why so many bloggers are being teased with access. Time, like most of the establishment MSM, don't want to hit too hard because of their access to the political class.

@53_3 There isn't just one thing that is driving the cost up.

mzmartipants:
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Of course, but unnecessary procedures, even at 30%, are not the driver. Real medical expenses are not encountered when seeing the doctor via appointments at the doctors' office. I have a brother in law who had a severe case of walking pneumonia and nearly died.
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The bulk of the cost:
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The rehab clinic, where he spent three+ months, who charged $4000 / day for his inpatient care. Doctor's fees were a small part of the total $550,000 bill.
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This is just one example. I have about 35 family and freinds my age (55) to draw experiences from. These experiences are very instructive...

We have thousands of people in the health care industry making millions of dollars a yr on the illness,pain,grief of americans. We need single payer, paid for by taxes, like roads,sewer systems and the military...at the very least an affordable public option[voluntary] and major controls on health ins companies...just as most half intelligent people have learned we need to control the financial sector.

Exactly why are our senators and representatives so much more concerned about respecting the will of the Iranians about their leadership than the will of the folks here at home about heath care reform?