For Love or Money...or Social Policy

Forgive me if I overgeneralize, but it seems to me that the same people who spend the most energy here in this country railing against Islam are the ones most likely to embrace the most patriarchal and oppressive versions of their own chosen faith. It's what I like to refer to as the fun-house mirror effect. The evil they see so clearly in others is simply an image of themselves distorted just enought that they fail to recognize it.

"[H]er husband's courtship--however unhinged--further erases the cultural belief that rape renders a woman damaged and unwanted for life."

Or it becomes the exception that proves the rule . . . . Somehow I doubt that this courtship is going to have a big effect on how Pakistanis generally feel about rape victims.

Rape is such a vicious crime.

As for Paul's comment, what we conservatives wonder about is the "Hear no evil, see no evil, speak no evil" attitude that the left-wing seems to have about some of the ugly manifestations of Islam around the world (e.g., honor killings).

what we liberals wonder about is the "Hear no evil, see no evil, speak no evil" attitude that the right-wing seems to have about some of the ugly manifestations of Christianity around the world
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==quote fixed==

It's not that liberals see-no-evil regarding the ugly manifestations of Islam. They simply don't beleive that cruise missles are the ideal solution.
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And sites such as Atlas Shrugged and The Jawa Report that literally obsess over the ugly manifestations of Islam are themselves one of the ugly manifestations of which we speak.

what we Whigs wonder about is the "Hear no evil, see no evil, speak no evil" attitude that the Know-Nothing wing seems to have about some of the ugly manifestations of Slavery around the country.
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==quote fixed again==
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You can make a generality like this fit any prejudice you happen to have about anything. It's perfectly meaningless. Best you got, spob?

Paul, I don't think that pointing to a few blogs is really all that convincing. People do focus their energies.

As for the ugly manifestations of Christianity, I think Islam has Christianity beat by a country mile in both numbers and severity.

And Paul, we don't think cruise missiles are all that effective either.

As for Friar Tuck, well, like I said, a hell of a lot of women's rights organizations don't have a ton to say about FGM, forced marriages, legal disabilities etc. Just weird. It's as if there's a hierarchy of political correctness that governs this stuff.

a hell of a lot of women's rights organizations don't have a ton to say about FGM, forced marriages, legal disabilities etc.
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Name one.

What are you frickin' talking about? Which are these women's rights groups you speak of?

Ugly manifestations are by no means limited to the Islamic religion. We have quite a few crazy fringe religious groups right here in the United States. Remember the Westborough Baptist group? You know, those lunatics who protest at our service member's funerals carrying around signs that read "Thank God for IED's"? How about Pat Robertson claiming on national teevee that 9/11 was God's punishment for gays? What about the fruitcakes who protested at Matthew Shephard's funeral after he was beaten and crucified? The nuts who target abortion providers and blow up the clinics? Jim Jones, Hagee, Koresh, Falwell? They're all crazies that have nothing to do with Islam. They're homegrown products of our own christian extremists. Take a look at the fringe group of Mormons in Utah with the teen brides. Islam has their crazies. Chritianity does too. Some of us on the left look at religion and see crazies everywhere. The ugly manifestations pollute all religions. The decent people in all religions abhor the practices of their fringe elements. The problem isn't limited to Islam by any stretch of the imagination. They're just the easiest target right now.

Yeah, Tuck, it's amazing. These people's head are apparently stuffed with straw.

As for Mukhtar, she's staying in her village and says her husband can come visit her. Not exactly the stuff of fairy tales.
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Yeah...weird.
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Most people wouldn't put the words "fairy tale" into a story that begins with a gang rape, but then Amy Sullivan must not be most people.

@Paul: Don't forget LGF in the list of anti-Islam obsessives.
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Re: "speak no evil". There are many, MANY, "Left-Wing" organizations that speak out against human rights abuses. Human Rights Watch, Amnesty International, and, hear in the US, the ACLU, all come to mind...
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Unfortunately, these groups, as well as women's rights organizations, are all challenged to give adequate voice to Human Rights abuses of all types, while being relentlessly shouted at by the right.

@spob
What is it do you soppose I'm trying to convince you of?
There's a lot of members of what we refer to as the Republican base who are significantly motivated by a hatred of Islam and its practitioners and another significant subset who feel the same way about Mexicans. We'll leave Black and Gays out of the discussion.
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Attendance at Sarah Palin rallys included large percentages of the folks I'm referring to. While many Republicans don't share these core hatreds and prejudices, many of the ones who don't nevertheless have no qualms about feeding the dragon. See Dick Cheney's latest
interview for a fine example.
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This is just how the world is. I didn't choose it.
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As for comparing Islam to Christianity, whatever conclusions you may draw today differ significantly from what's been the case at other times in History. This says nothing about the two religions and quite a lot about the embrace of enlightenment values in the West. Certainly our Constitution and Bill Of Rights have as much to say about our progress in Human Rights than anything provided by any particular faith.

Yeah, many in the GOP want to enforce the rules when it comes to illegal immigration and we're a bunch of racists. Whatever. Or we don't believe in race preferences and we're racists. Whatever. Just remember, though, when Trent Lott said what he said, he paid. Obama admits, in writing, to being inspired by a speech that contains the trite racist nonsense "white folks' greed runs a world in need", and you guys call us the racists. Whatever. And yes, I know what I am saying about Obama.

As for gays, simply because we oppose gay marriage (particularly when imposed by an unelected judiciary) we're homophobes (although you may want to check, there is considerable anti-gay violence emanating from minority communities).

As for the human rights groups, don't get me started. Human Rights Watch cares more about bashing Israel than honor killings. And as for the rest, the issue is emphasis.

Don't forget too, Paul, that many many enlightenment figures were deeply religious men. It's hard to separate the values of the enlightenment from their religion.

Rape in any form, or reason is totally un-just. But, I have studied Islam enough to know that in the Muslim world, male dominance is the core principal for their beliefs. Islam would like to take the world back a few hundred years in order to justify their means.
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The debate above, with my liberal "friends" simply proves my point so far as the conservative belief that you cannot condone the behavior or belief in general, if someone is "raped" as a result.
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While I do not believe Christianity is perfect by any means, it is in my opinion a much more forgiving and tolerant religion than the rest. (Plus the fact that if you do not believe in Christ as your Lord and savior you are doomed to hell for eternity).
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Islam for the most part wants to destroy the United States and believes it is the "Great Satan". Not believing in Islam as the one and only religion they recognize, not only condemns you to hell, but the fact that you do not believe in Islam places you as the "Infidel" and you should not be allowed to live. While Christianity would like you to believe, there are no harbored ills if you choose to do otherwise. We will just pray for your soul and hope that one day you will see the "light".
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This is the difference between Christianity and Islam my friends, as simply as I can put it to allow your liberal minds the opportunity to expand. I shall pray for my liberal friends, and hope they may see the light.
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Have a great day!

I was reading about the Taliban in Ms magazine long before the mainstream media picked up the story.
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Doomed to hell for eternity. Ha ha! That God fellow is such a joker.

Arent conservatives now aligned with the grand polygamists the Mormons in the Republican party? Isn't the official conservative position nonintervention when it comes to internal conflicts in foreign lands or human suffering? Aren't a lot of conservatives Catholic and again aren't they aligned in the Republican party with a religious heirarchy that damn near sanctioned the rape of young boys by their priests? Now I don't say this to claim that conservatives are any worse than liberals or progressives. Instead just to point out that glass houses are a b*tch. Be careful with that first stone homey, its a doozy!

This is hilarious:

http://justoneminute.typepad.com/main/2009/03/maybe-stupid-will-work.html

want to enforce the rules when it comes to illegal immigration and we're a bunch of racists. Whatever. Or we don't believe in race preferences and we're racists
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People who aren't racist simply don't spend all that much time worrying about it one way or another. Odd that you would suddenly be joined by Rusty, who is one of the most unabashed examples of what I mean.
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I can't say that people who want to 'enforce immigration laws' don't have a point. But that's not what motivates them. And what determines the contents of our 'immigration laws' in the first place?

Islam for the most part wants to destroy the United States and believes it is the "Great Satan".
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This is absolute nonsense. Muslims for the most part just don't care about the United States. You think people shopping in the market in Jakarta are chanting anti-American slogans? That Moroccans go to sleep at night, after burning an American flag? That the cabbies who stop at the mosque three blocks from me are secretly planning revolution? Or that the guys who run the halal butchershop are killers waiting for their opportunity to strike?
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Have you ever been in an Islamic country? IME, the differences are strikingly small. Most people aren't terribly observant and religion doesn't play an important role in their lives. Just like here. Sure, Ramadan is a big deal, as is Christmas. But that doesn't mean that most people are hitting the prayer rug five times a day.
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And, of course, American allies, such as Saudi Arabia are among the most oppressive countries, especially towards women

While Christianity would like you to believe, there are no harbored ills if you choose to do otherwise
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(Plus the fact that if you do not believe in Christ as your Lord and savior you are doomed to hell for eternity).:D
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While Christianity would like you to believe, there are no harbored ills if you choose to do otherwise
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(Plus the fact that if you do not believe in Christ as your Lord and savior you are doomed to hell for eternity).:D
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While Christianity would like you to believe, there are no harbored ills if you choose to do otherwise
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(Plus the fact that if you do not believe in Christ as your Lord and savior you are doomed to hell for eternity).:D
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This can only be self-parody.

I, in turn, shall pray for my conservative friends, and hope they may see the light, in whatever color or shape it chooses to shine.
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"I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ." - Mahatma Gandhi

That last sentence shouldn't have been italicized.

Doomed to hell for eternity because I don't accept Christ as my Lord and Savior?

Can't I just send Rush a birthday card and call it even?

STFU, sgwhite, you're the idiot that thinks that white high school students should be beaten senseless because they deserve it. You're an ass. That pathetic liberals in here actually support anything you say is telling. I guess they think you have some authenticity or street cred or something. In actuality, you're just a stupid racist ass.